English or Foreign

[TheDoctor46]

I know the lake you fish gazza they have been in there since 64' then another stock came in early 70's all good fish though thats why i like them you seen the pike in there as well!

[TheDoctor46]

What is the strain of carp that has been bred in the UK the longest?

you have 7 strains(races) of carp

the galician carp from north of the carpathian mountains in eastern europe. they are the most wide spread of all carp. go over 40lb.

the ropsha carp from hungary are found maily in france and inhabit the river systems, these carp are all commons. rarely go over 30lb

the dinkelsbuehl carp "dinks" from germany and are aslo found in this country, if you fish dorchester lagoon oxfordshire these are the fish you will catch. rarely go over 30lb but can (these are the fish you are most likely to find in the commercial fisheries)

the italian carpfound also in the uk, if you fish waveney valley lakes norfolk or savay. quite large framed fish and will grow over 40lb

the frame carp, named because of the scale patterns running either along its back or flanks. these are the fish stocked at fishabil in france. not noted to grow that big, to 40lb

the aischgrund carp named after the river aisch which flows into the river main and then into the river rhine. found in many french lake in central france. the humpy back things. these are truely ugly and grow fast they can reach weights of 45lb in ten years.

and the royale carp farmed by louis the 14th is what i think is the best looking strain of fish found in southern france in the river systems and lakes.

the first carp stocked were the "galicians", they were stocked into redmire and a few more. the now called "native" fish will be a mix of some of these fish. the fact though remains that carp fishing in this country is a farce, you don't even know if they are true or not and also the "galician" carp are those stocked into redmire.

so from that we can tell what carp we are fishing for, and will not end up catching a wrong un. i will try to get some pictures of the fish so you can tell. also would like to say from looking at "two tone" i would say it is a "royale" and "benson" would be "itailian" or "galician" mixed with "royale".

The carp have many features to look for, "galician" have both forks of the tail pointed, "rospha" are very streamline so if mixed or imported you will know, the "dinks" are mainly mirrors but commons,linears and leathers can be found, the "italian" the monument fish look like these, big and round, the "frame" has scales that border the upper and lower flanks of the fish and they look round (we all know what fishbil fish look like), the "royale" looks just like "two tone" low fairly straight back long and big and the best looking fish around scale tend to be very large and in the middle of the body along the latteral line (not linear)and a long head,"aischgrund" fish are large backed with flat bodies and just simply ugly.

[Stig]

Originally Posted by Phil highlander

One of my major worries is the import of pests and diseases

Have we not already got enough of them in this fair land or are times getting so bad that we have to import NODDYS from abroad to annoy us on the bank ..

[gazza]

Originally Posted by TheDoctor46

I know the lake you fish gazza they have been in there since 64' then another stock came in early 70's all good fish though thats why i like them you seen the pike in there as well!

Yes i've seen a few of the pike, even caught one on dog biscuits lol. And have heard they go to 26lb, thats a big snapper

As for the carp I was just being mischievous yesterday, I wasn't trying to wind people up, merely add my own thoughts to what is a very contentious area of the sport

[davidg]

Well I did say lets get a discussion going - just did'nt expect such a responce!
The one good thing about our sport is that you can select your water and fish for your prefered choise. Tight lines to one and all

For you to fish for a legimately stocked foreign 40lb carp,
how many fish have suffered and perished for you to be
able to fish for that one fish?

Of course that question can't be answered definitively, but
as I care about the quarry I fish for, I will never support
the stocking of large fish from overseas, as I would be
supporting the suffering of these very large carp and there
not so lucky brothers and sisters.

You don't seem to read much about these fish that die 'in transit'
or soon after stocking, but it is a very real part of stocking
large fish. A 12hr plus journey in a tank in the back of a transit.

Well would you support that? . . . I suppose it doesn't make good
reading, unlike the trophy shots of there surviving brothers and
sisters.

I just don't think its fair on the fish.

[bash]

as some of the above anglers have said.... they dont mind fishing for a 30 or 40 no matter where it comes from. Each to their own and that but what they dont appreciate is that a ready made 30 or 40 , imported from abroad, takes away what is so special about catching a fish of that size. You may well catch a fish of big weight but it cannot EVER be compared to the capture of a true English fish of the same size because the goalposts have so obviously been widened. It is a hollow capture with no meaning .

Its like sneaking into Old Trafford when its shut and kicking a ball into the net..... YES you have scored a goal at Old Trafford.... but does it mean anything ?.... Does it FK.

[Deano]

Originally Posted by martin.allerton

A 12hr plus journey in a tank in the back of a transit.

Well would you support that? . . . I suppose it doesn't make good
reading, unlike the trophy shots of there surviving brothers and
sisters.

I just don't think its fair on the fish.

A good point and one that has got me thinking...I think if i knew that fish were dying during the importation process and were being transported 'in the back of a transit van' then I would seriously have to reconsider fishing certain waters.The owner of one lake containing imports I have fished treats his fish like babies...but I don't know how they got here...surely not in a transit....but I don't dispute that it may happen ...unfortunately.
As for Bash saying the capture of a large imported fish being hollow...well each to there own I suppose but its still an exhilarating and memorable occasion if you are lucky enough to land a 40lb fish no matter where its from...but i do agree it would be better to land an English 40 that has lived in the same water from small or even all of its life. As long as the fish are healthy and I don't hear any horror stories about the importation process i will continue to fish waters with imported carp as its a 'novelty'....to me its just like going to France etc only cheaper

[Northern_monkey]

I wouldn't even consider fishing a venue that i knew had imported carp in the lakes.

For me it english all the way I simply refuse to line the pockets of some greedy fishery owner and fish among "instant" anglers after a 40lb carp without trying

Originally Posted by Northern_monkey

I wouldn't even consider fishing a venue that i knew had imported carp in the lakes.

For me it english all the way I simply resuse to line the pockets of some greedy fishery owner and fish among "instant" anglers after a 40lb carp without trying

so well put